Deinterlacing in 2024...

That's what I always thought but whenever I capture with Huff and send it to Hybrid the media info section always says bottom field first I just ignore and ask it to overwrite input scan to TFF.

Hybrid's wrong. I just fired up the latest version and with a confirmed TFF capture AVI, Hybrid is saying it's BFF.

I hope I am doing the correct thing by ignoring it?

Don't ignore it. On the Filtering tab, on the right, tick the "overwrite input scan type" and set TFF.

I wonder if that setting affects any other function?

Hybrid really shouldn't be reporting any scan type because the scan type for these types of AVIs is not stored in the file data AFAIK.

@Selur care to comment?

So MediaInfo may be blamed.

Media Info doesn't display anything except "Interlaced" for Huff files.

Originally Posted by Alwyn

Hybrid's wrong. I just fired up the latest version and with a confirmed TFF capture AVI, Hybrid is saying it's BFF.

It uses media info.
Whenever Huffyuv is used as source input codec it has always reported BFF, no matter what capture card is used.


I used to think it was because the capture card was capturing BFF, I like yourself use the GV-USB2 .

Originally Posted by Alwyn

Don't ignore it. On the Filtering tab, on the right, tick the "overwrite input scan type" and set TFF.

I wonder if that setting affects any other function?

Hybrid really shouldn't be reporting any scan type because the scan type for these types of AVIs is not stored in the file data AFAIK.

@Selur care to comment?

I overwrite input scan and always change it to TFF because I have been told VHS is always TFF.

Originally Posted by Sharc

Yes, the field order is not flagged in standard .avi container. And even when it is flagged (e.g. for DV (BFF) or other containers) there are many "opportunities" in a processing chain to flag it wrongly. So in any case make a manual check and set it right, independent of what tools may be reporting. Always.

From my own personal experience in this if Lagrith codec is used on input file hybrid media info panel always reports as progressive BUT if HUFFYUV is used Hybrid media info panel always reports aa BFF, no matter what capture card id used to capture the file in virtualdub, I stupidly use to think, one of my other cards Avermedia EZ7 might be sending frames BFF.

I am just a newbie who likes to read these forums and comments when in need of help ot if I can contribute to the discussion so does this mean all capture cards capture in coming VHS footage as TFF? someone please clarify.

Swiss knife Avisynth or Vapoursynth is for this. By now, you should have Avisynth+ installed. Load your avi, set field order and separate fields. Play that avs in MPC-HC or else. If fields follow nicely each other when stepping one frame forward, that field order is correct.

Code:

Avisource("video.avi")
Assumetff()
SeparateFields()

does this mean all capture cards capture in coming VHS footage as TFF? someone please clarify.

I have never come across a BFF analogue capture.

Swiss knife Avisynth or Vapoursynth is for this.

... to determine the field order.

I described how to use Virtual Dub to easily work out the field order of a file in post #119: Deinterlace filter>set YADIF Double Frame Rate TFF and check the frame by frame motion.

It uses media info.

I'm not so sure. Your comment about Lagarith reminded me; how could Media Info be so randomly wrong? For HUFF, Hybrid reckons Mediainfo it says it's BFF when it's really TFF (and Media Info only reports "Interlaced") and for LAGS it says it's Prog when it's TFF (and Mediainfo doesn't report anything at all)?

Anyway, doesn't matter, now you know the issue, you can compensate for it. And you now know how to determine the field order if you want to check.

Originally Posted by _Al_

Swiss knife Avisynth or Vapoursynth is for this. By now, you should have Avisynth+ installed. Load your avi, set field order and separate fields. Play that avs in MPC-HC or else. If fields follow nicely each other when stepping one frame forward, that field order is correct.

Code:

Avisource("video.avi")
Assumetff()
SeparateFields()

Avisynth was download automatically during hybrid installation.

If it can work like that then fine I don't want to download stuff.


I couldn't get frameserve to work in VD I went into the VD file and clicked on as I read
it does nothing. I just left it

Originally Posted by Alwyn

I'm not so sure. Your comment about Lagarith reminded me; how could Media Info be so randomly wrong? For HUFF, Hybrid reckons Mediainfo it says it's BFF when it's really TFF (and Media Info only reports "Interlaced") and for LAGS it says it's Prog when it's TFF (and Mediainfo doesn't report anything at all)?

Anyway, doesn't matter, now you know the issue, you can compensate for it. And you now know how to determine the field order if you want to check.

Yes I temporarily de-interlace in in VD, try both TFF and BFF if I get a backwards forwards motion then it's the wrong field order but I don't get that I've tried this in the past.

Originally Posted by lollo

Mediainfo is just a flag reader and not reliable.

Once more, to check the field order there is no need to deinterlace, just follow post #127

Can I just do this in notepad

Code:
Avisource("video.avi")
Assumetff()
SeparateFields()

Like this if I need to:

Open notepad
type
Avisource ("what evermyvideoname.avi)
Assumetff ()
SeparateFields()

I couldn't get virtualldub t install frame server, I clicked and opened the handle file it doesn't do anything.

Yes I temporarily de-interlace in in VD, try both TFF and BFF if I get a backwards forwards motion then it's the wrong field order but I don't get that I've tried this in the past.

That's because you haven't to worry about it previously; analogue captures are "always" TFF. But when you saw it (BFF) in Hybrid, it threw you, which is, of course, understandable. If you just set Hybrid, every time, to TFF, you won't have any issues. And if you do tell Hybrid it's TFF when it's really BFF (highly unusual, as I say, with analogue captures), the encoded file will have the same jerky motion so you can just do it again with BFF set.

Originally Posted by Lollo

1- install AviSynth
2- create a file called check.avs with notepad and write in it:
Code:
AviSource("<filename>.avi")
AssumeTFF()
separateFields()
3- open the file check.avs with VirtualDub
4- in VirtualDub use the mouse wheel to display the fields of the video in motion. If you see a consistent motion the AssumeTFF() is ok, otherwise change it to AssumeBFF(); while there you can also understand the field architecture of your video (interlaced, telecined, phase-shifted, etc.)

Why is that any different to simply double-rate deinterlacing in VDub? Or Bob Doubling in VDub?

Originally Posted by Selur

if the report interlaced with not field order, it guesses the field order based on the format.

Given that none of these analogue AVIs are BFF and no field order is reported, Hybrid should default to TFF or remain blank and therefore require the user to input a field order, IMO.

Originally Posted by Sharc

@Alwyn: using your (or any other) method(s), what would be your conclusion here (and what should a smart tool be reporting)?

I'm asking the question. I am not stating that VDub's Deint or Bob is better. It is certainly simpler. I would like to know why going via AVISynth is better. If the question isn't already obvious to you, what visual difference/advantage is there between "separate Fields" and double rate deinterlacing/bobbing?

and what should a smart tool be reporting

I don't know! All we want is a simple method to determine the field order. What sort of smart tool are you referring to?

Anyway, I asked the question of Lollo. How about you let him answer instead of quizzing me.

Well, you had a proposal what Hybrid should do in the other case. So I thought you could tell in this case a s well

No, that is not the same thing. There is a subtle difference between proposing something and asking for information.

Sure, so?

?

For sure I remember Scharfis_brain, the interlace Guru . Learned a lot from him.

Originally Posted by lollo

I couldn't get virtualldub t install frame server, I clicked and opened the handle file it doesn't do anything.

1- install AviSynth
2- create a file called check.avs with notepad and write in it:

Code:

AviSource("<filename>.avi")
AssumeTFF()
separateFields()

3- open the file check.avs with VirtualDub
4- in VirtualDub use the mouse wheel to display the fields of the video in motion. If you see a consistent motion the AssumeTFF() is ok, otherwise change it to AssumeBFF(); while there you can also understand the field architecture of your video (interlaced, telecined, phase-shifted, etc.)

I'm going to do this over the weekend.
I have it installed but I don't think I checked
open with notpad during installation?

I may need more help guys